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Info-Atari16 Digest   Wednesday, August 23, 1989   Volume 89 : Issue 411

This weeks Editor: Bill Westfield

Today's Topics:

             Re: QUESTION ABOUT SEAGATE HARD DRIVE/SUBSTN
                     Modula-2 (esp. TDI version)
                            RE: user base
                       RE:  St and Multitasking
                            Atari Archives
                        Re: DOS 3 errata notes
                     Re: Slots for the (Mega) ST
                     Re: New Atari 68030 Machines
                     Re: New Atari 68030 Machines
             Re: Atari loyalty....How long can it last...
              Any Make-Your-Own-Music program out there?
            HELP IDENTIFYING SEAGATE 296N WITH REV. 7 ROM
                         Hard drive questions

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Date: 18 Aug 89 01:47:25 GMT
From: agate!helios.ee.lbl.gov!lbl-csam.arpa![e-mail]  (Antony
 A. Courtney)
Subject: Re: QUESTION ABOUT SEAGATE HARD DRIVE/SUBSTN
To: [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Mike Whitbeck) writes:
>hard drive. I recently ordered an Atari Megafile 30 from ST-Plus
>(aka Zephyr Microsystems). After a month - still no drive
>(it was shipped but must have been lost by UPS, we'll ship
>another right away, oh well that one was the last and it was
>sold over the counter - sorry when we restock we'll rush  one to
>you PRIORITY!, oh, er uh- we decided not to restock (meanwhile
>my VISA bill comes with the charge on it!), we'll refund your
>money less 20% (over $100!!), - you (the buyer) are responsible
>if you don't get the drive you ordered, UPS MAY make YOU pay for
>the lost drive....) *

>the owner(?) talk me into a 138N in a ICD box and a ??(BMS?)
>controller. WELL AM I GONNA REGTET THIS?

I hope not, although I can't say things look promising...

> New owners? Bad day for the boss? Karma? It

> As for the trace, I have not yet received the shipper no. for
> Zephyr/ST-Plus but a quick check under both names show no
> shipments made. I'll let you good folk know how this melodrama
> resolves itself.
>
> [e-mail]  | [e-mail]

I am sorry to say I have had a similar bad experience with this company.  I
was working as a contract software developer for the owner of the store
developing a desktop publishing package.  Shortly after I began development
however, Calamus was released and it became painfully apparent that there was
no way I could get a product to market in time to compete with Calamus, as my
development time was rather limited.  Before entering into the deal, we made
damned sure my contract was very very clear about what would happen if it
became necessary for either party to reneage on the contract.  He had lent me
hardware worth about 2x as much as I had given him, and if we needed to break
the contract, I would give him the hardware and anything I had developed, and
he would give me back my money.  Without going into detail, he took weeks to
get me a check, and then the check bounced three times.  It took a call to the
fraud department in order to get him to pay up.

And this is not the only time I have known him to do slimey business.  He was
audited by the IRS for tax evasion, and he had to pay taxes plus a sufficient
fine.  And there have been any number of other things he has done which I
personally consider bad business.  The tactic you describe sounds exactly like
something he would pull.  The store is called Micro-World.  The mail order
company is called ST-Plus.  Zephyr is the name of a T-Shirt shop next door to
it which he also owns.

(And for those of you with a cynical eye about my having to bow out of the
contract--I consider it to have been the only responsible thing to do.  I could
have easily beaten around the bush and developed a half-decent DTP package. But
by the time it would have been released, it would not have been very
market competetive.  And for credibility I have worked for about half a year
now doing graphics and network systems programming for the Advanced Development
Group at Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory and haven't get along extremely well with
my boss and co-workers)

These are JUST MY OPINIONS and perceptions.  I probably would not have posted
this except that mikew appears to have had similar bad experience with them,
and people should be forewarned.

Let the buyer beware....

            -Antony
*******************************************************************************
Antony A. Courtney                [e-mail]
Advanced Development Group            ucbvax!lbl-csam.arpa!antony
Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory            [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 18 Aug 89 02:04:03 GMT
From: ncis.tis.llnl.gov!blackbird![e-mail]  (News System
 Account)
Subject: Modula-2 (esp. TDI version)
To: [e-mail]

I would ask any owners of the TDI Modula-2 package send a email reply to
this message. (Hit 'r' now) Thanks. Bill

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Bill Hodges                    |  Me?  People who speak for the Air Force get
 [e-mail]  |  paid a lot more than I do! I just work here.

------------------------------

Date:         18 AUG 89 03:08:00 CST
From:     Z4648252 <[e-mail]>
To:       <[e-mail]>
Subject:  RE: user base

Stephen McKay Matson writes:

> Does anyone have an idea how many ST's & MEGA's have been sold in N.A.
> and Europe as well as Asia ect.

    September '89 issue of STart has an interview with Sam Tramiel in
which he states:

"We don't give country-by-country numbers.  Obviously, we've been shipping
more than the lion's share outside the United States, especially since
late 1987 and 1988.  Around the world now I'm guess that it's approaching
                     %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
one-and-a-half-million machines."
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

Larry Rymal in East Texas <[e-mail]>

------------------------------

Date:         18 AUG 89 03:08:03 CST
From:     Z4648252 <[e-mail]>
To:       <[e-mail]>
Subject:  RE:  St and Multitasking

Steven Usher writes:

>I can see one or two major problems with TOS if you try to make
>it multitask.  The biggest problem is the file system. What
>happens when two tasks want to access the same file at the same
>time? What error message do you return? TOS cannot handle such
>things and there are no error returns which mean "in use".

    Don't ever say NEVER or CANNOT.  Just doesn't work when dealing
with computers.  Tim Purves' BBS versions 2.0 and up can and do
work well when the same file is accessed by two tasks on an ST.
    While a user is logged onto the ST, accessing a file (downloading),
another user, or even the SysOp can access or download the same file.
No crashes, no bombers.  It just works.

Larry Rymal in East Texas <[e-mail]>

------------------------------

Date:     Fri, 18 Aug 89 02:14:31 -0900
To:       [e-mail]
Reply-To: <[e-mail]>
From:     "alas, Babylon"  <[e-mail]>

RE: Pagestream 1.5 vs 1.X
    Having been severely tempted to bash my hardware when version 1.5 bombed
for the 3rd time in 5 minutes, I need to hear kinder,gentler things said about
whatever the next higher, more bugs shot out, version is. Is there a 1.6, and
does it fly without crashing?  Thanks..drowning in PageStream...J Harris

------------------------------

Date: 11 Aug 89 10:39:45 GMT
From: mcvax!ukc!dcl-cs!gdt!gdr![e-mail]  (Mark Harding)
Subject: Atari Archives
To: [e-mail]

I'm interested in Atari Public Domain archives (who isn't!).

I now know of Terminator - if anyboday has other addresses I would be
grateful...

   Cheers, Mark H.

--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

  One of these days, on the Dark Side if the Moon I'll see Emily  Play and
you'll Wish You Were Here.

------------------------------

Date: 18 Aug 89 05:50:04 GMT
From: blake!ndsuvax![e-mail]  (Brett G. Person)
Subject: Re: DOS 3 errata notes
To: [e-mail]

I think I have the notes.  Cant remember what version of DOS they
are for though.  Could someone explain to me why Atari produced
such useless documentation?  I still remember the ERROR- lines
in the BASIC listings in the DOS manual.  Why didnt someone proff
read the damned thing?  Quality control must really be bad when
an error message in the listing slips by!

Oh well, enough complaining
If I find the notes I'll post them
--
Brett G. Person
North Dakota State University
uunet!ndsuvax!ncperson | [e-mail] | [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 17 Aug 89 20:35:16 GMT
From:
 cs.utexas.edu!usc!henry.jpl.nasa.gov!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!hacgate!tcville!saxon!t
[e-mail]  (Robert Terry)
Subject: Re: Slots for the (Mega) ST
To: [e-mail]

This is my first post to any news-group here. :)

I recently obtained a quite a few files from comp.binary.st (sp?) to run on
my ST Mega machine. Undecoding the files was the easy part. I wasn't able
to "extract" the sub-files from undecoded files. When it failed each time,
it said that I need a newer version of "ARC.TTP".

Could anyone out there please direct me to the ftp address and obtain the
most recent arc.ttp program? Thank you very much! :)

Please reply by email. As of now, I have 382 messages to catch up on this
news-group!! :]

My email:

[e-mail]

P.S. I hope I didn't goof here! :)


Robert Terry
Hughes Aircraft Co.                      TDD:  [phone]
Image and Signal Processing Lab         email:  [e-mail]
PO Box 902, E53/E250

------------------------------

Date: 18 Aug 89 03:10:02 GMT
From: portal!cup.portal.com![e-mail]  (dave l smythe)
Subject: Re: New Atari 68030 Machines
To: [e-mail]

Does anyone know the form factor of the new '030 Atari's VME bus?
Did they shoot themselves in the foot again by not using the full-size
VME cards?

Inquiring minds want to know...

Dave Smythe
[e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 18 Aug 89 00:11:47 GMT
From: portal!cup.portal.com![e-mail]
Subject: Re: New Atari 68030 Machines
To: [e-mail]

> What I really wonder of course is if either of them will compete at all
> with the Sun/HP/Dec 68020/68030 machines out there. Five companies each
> claiming 30% of the market :-)

> --Chuck McManis

    Umm, Digital doesn't make any 680x0 UN*X workstations.

    For the record, we make:

    The DECstation-3100, a MIPS RISC processor UN*X workstation, and
    the VAXstation-II,2000,3100, et al, VAX processor based UN*X or
    VMS based workstations. All of them come with DECwindows as the
    user interface...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Henry B. Messenger                 [e-mail]
Digital Equipment Corporation isn't responsible for anything I say on
USENET.

------------------------------

Date: 18 Aug 89 04:44:37 GMT
From: portal!cup.portal.com![e-mail]
Subject: Re: Atari loyalty....How long can it last...
To: [e-mail]

Chuck Rickard asks about Atari management..
>Now you wonder whe%rther this is_ Atari's ignorance or do they don't care!

>Please reply.  Tell me what you think.  I won't get any responses from Atari
>They don't care.

Atari Corp. is run by a bunch of amateurs.  My niece's Junior Achievement
Company could run Atari far better than the current management does.

When I think of Atari Corp., I get the mental image of an old Keystone Kops
movie where everyone is chasing themselves back and forth across a long
hallway, in and out of doorways.. no one knowing what's going on, or who's
doing what.

Unfortunately, as has been pointed out before, it's THEIR company.. they can
run it any way they want to, as long as they own a majority of the stock.
That includes lying to their customers and dealers, treating user groups
badly, using threats to control dealers, and just generally mistreating
anyone who gets in the way.

Neil Harris (who?) once made a comment on CompuServe about Digital Research,
saying in his most clever manner that there was an industry rumor that
the reason DRI didn't do (whatever it was), was that their goal was to stay
a "small company forever"...

I thought it was truly ironic that a "mouthpiece" for Atari Corp. would
"cast stones" that way...  The way Atari Corp is managed, they must provide
a tremendous source of amusement in the board rooms of real companies like
Apple and IBM...  if those companies even notice Atari...

Yes, I love my ST...  but I'm ashamed of its parentage..

BobR

------------------------------

Date: 18 Aug 89 07:19:37 GMT
From: mcvax!sunic!dkuug!iesd![e-mail]  ( Lars Bo Nielsen )
Subject: Any Make-Your-Own-Music program out there?
To: [e-mail]

I was wondering if there are any music programs for the ST. What I am
looking for is a program where you can make your own music, and play
it using the speaker in the monitor (i.e. NOT using the MIDI). I would
prefer it to run on a monochrome monitor (thats the only one I got).

I have seen a programs just like that for both The Amiga and the
MacIntosh, so I was wondering if something exists for the ST.

Thanks for any help

 Lars Bo Nielsen @ Aalborg University - Denmark     [e-mail]

------------------------------

Date: 18 Aug 89 13:42:45 GMT
From: usc!orion.cf.uci.edu![e-mail]  ( James )
Subject: HELP IDENTIFYING SEAGATE 296N WITH REV. 7 ROM
To: [e-mail]

Say if I go to a computer story and ask for Seagate 296N drive, how would I
know/identify if it has the rev 7 ROM????

Please send me via mail or post.

James

Usenet: [e-mail]
Bitnet: [e-mail]

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Date:         Fri, 18 Aug 89 15:43:15 BST
From:         Mark Powell <[e-mail]>
Subject:      Hard drive questions
To:           Atari mailing list <[e-mail]>

   I'm new to the hard disk game. I should be getting my first ever, in about
a week for my ST (primarily for Minix use.) It'll be a TCT 65Mb. However,
I'd like a few questions about hard drives answered, if possible...

1. What controls the data transfer rate for a drive?
   I am led to believe that this is in the hands of the controller. After
   reading the documentation that comes along with the ICD utilities I was
   susrprised to learn about data transfer rates ranging from 300Ks to 1010Ks.
   What's the big difference with these controllers. Does the 1010Ks one cost
   the price of a small island in the Pacific?

2. I've heard that hard drives spin at about 3600 rpm. Therefore if your
   recommended interleave factor is one, will the controller read the track
   in a single revolution? If so doesn't that mean it is reading the track
   in 1/3600th of a second? (This can't be right!) I know the seek and
   latency times come into this, but if we just talk about the transfer rate
   i.e. the head sits over one track and just keeps continualy reading it, then
   why then can't it read the track 3600 times a second? I'm pretty sure this
   isn't what happens, but could someone explain why?

3. Also, when given a list of bad sectors, what does the controller do with
   it? Does store this info. somewhere on the disk so that in the future, it
   appears to all software that the disk has no bad sectors? Reference this
   to the Adaptec RLL controller if possible, as that's the one that comes
   in the TCT drives.

I'd appreciate any info. on hard disks that anyone can supply. Thanks.
Reply to the net as I think other people may find the info. of some use.
(also a CC: by e-mail if possible as news quite likes to go down, here.)

Mark Powell

ARPAnet : [e-mail],cs.ucl.ac.uk
USENET  : ...!mcvax!ukc!liv.ac.uk!sq79

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End of Info-Atari16 Digest
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